Discussion:
Reflections on a year of aircraft ownership
(too old to reply)
Mike Ash
2009-12-04 05:28:44 UTC
Permalink
Since the last one seemed to work pretty well, here's another
cross-posted shot at injecting some relevant content into the group.

My glider's condition inspection was due last month. When I bought my
share, one of the things I did as part of preparing to take ownership of
my share was to help out with last year's inspection (which gave me a
lot of valuable insight as to what everything looked like down in the
guts), meaning that it's now been a year since I bought into it.

So far I do not regret my decision to purchase in the least. I was wary
going into it, partly because owning an aircraft was something new to
me, and partly because this particular glider is much higher performance
and more complex (flaps and retractable gear) than anything I'd flown
before.

The performance and complexity turned out not to be a problem. The
ASW-20 got built in large numbers and is considered a "classic" for good
reason. I found it to be responsive without being twitchy, to handle
docilely, and to have no real bad habits. It took me about six months
before I got used to the flaps (they can be used for landing, but their
primary purpose is to increase efficiency in normal flight, so I'm
constantly moving them around as I change speeds) but ultimately that
was also no big deal. And, while the machine experienced a gear-up
landing in the spring, it wasn't me, the guy with almost no experience
in retractables, but my partner, who has probably spent more time in the
air than I've spent alive.

Owning an aircraft also wasn't a problem, although it's certainly been
more work than simply using club aircraft. While I originally wanted to
own an entire glider outright, it turned out that buying into a
partnership was an incredibly smart move, because that gave me an
instant ready pool of knowledge. Assembly/disassembly, trailering,
inspection preparations, instrument usage, installing a gear warning
system, diagnosing an unresponsive airspeed indicator, all of this was
helped enormously by having partners (and also by having the seller
nearby).

Money wasn't a worry to me, but it's still something I thought about. So
far, so good. I put 55.4 hours on it over the past year, and my share of
the costs have been around $700, which works out to under $13/hour.
Beats renting club aircraft, even ignoring the fact that mine is far,
far nicer than the club's. (Of course I'm cleverly ignoring opportunity
cost on the purchase price, depreciation, etc., and I still have to pay
the regular rate for tows, but still, it's nicely cheap.)

On the plus side, wow, what a machine. I love this glider the way a
normal person might love a woman. It's just an absolute joy to fly.

The performance is incredible. The book promises a 43:1 glide ratio, and
it delivers. At high speeds, it still flies practically flat. On a good
day I'll just set off cross country spontaneously, and only once in the
past year have I not made it back home. (And even then I still made it
to an airport.) Climb performance is also nice, although I wouldn't call
it a "floater". The flaps allow me to fly slow and turn tightly in a
thermal, more so than otherwise.

Landing performance is just breathtaking. Full flaps, full spoilers, and
Vne for that combination (which is a mere 65kts) gives me a 2:1 glide
slope and an incredibly short rollout. I haven't had to land it in a
field yet, but when that day comes, I have no worries about my ability
to squeeze it into a small one.

It's also pretty comfortable, which is important when I'm in it for 5+
hours at a time. The only downside is that the cockpit is kind of small,
so I can't stretch out much, especially on the legs and feet, but this
isn't a big deal. Performance and comfort were the two things that
really bugged me about the otherwise-great 1-26 that a good friend was
letting me fly before, and they're why I didn't buy a 1-26 of my own.

It's a piece of cake to assemble, which means I'm not afraid to fly it
on marginal days. I'm the envy of anyone assembling the club's Open
Cirrus, and of my friend who owns a Ventus, as my wings line up and lock
together like magnets every time. (For those of you who fly powered
aircraft, the idea of assembling your plane before you fly it every day
may sound strange and frightening. It's actually pretty easy to do, at
least if you have the right kind of glider. It only takes me about 30
minutes from start to finish, and most of that is doing fiddly little
bits like hooking up the controls or taping up the gaps on the wings and
tail.)

And of course, it's *mine*, which means that on a good day I can fly it
for as long as I'm wiling and able to keep it airborne, rather than
being called down after an hour or two like in club aircraft. I can also
take it cross country, something which is de facto not allowed in club
gliders. And, although I haven't taken advantage of this yet, I can take
it to other airports and fly it there.

55.4 hours and 35 flights in a year. A lot of those flights were
familiarization flights or just fun flights when conditions didn't
permit soaring, so my average soaring flight time is probably 2+ hours,
with the best one at nearly 6 hours. I haven't kept close track, but
I've made several cross country flights, totaling maybe 500 miles, which
is pretty good considering that I haven't been pushing it hard at all as
I get used to it.

All in all, it's been a great year. All of the good things that I
anticipated in owning an aircraft have come true, and none of the bad
things. It was a great choice, and I'm looking forward to another year
with it.
--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon
Mark
2009-12-04 15:32:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Ash
Since the last one seemed to work pretty well, here's another
cross-posted shot at injecting some relevant content into the group.
My glider's condition inspection was due last month. When I bought my
share, one of the things I did as part of preparing to take ownership of
my share was to help out with last year's inspection (which gave me a
lot of valuable insight as to what everything looked like down in the
guts), meaning that it's now been a year since I bought into it.
So far I do not regret my decision to purchase in the least. I was wary
going into it, partly because owning an aircraft was something new to
me, and partly because this particular glider is much higher performance
and more complex (flaps and retractable gear) than anything I'd flown
before.
The performance and complexity turned out not to be a problem. The
ASW-20 got built in large numbers and is considered a "classic" for good
reason. I found it to be responsive without being twitchy, to handle
docilely, and to have no real bad habits. It took me about six months
before I got used to the flaps (they can be used for landing, but their
primary purpose is to increase efficiency in normal flight, so I'm
constantly moving them around as I change speeds) but ultimately that
was also no big deal. And, while the machine experienced a gear-up
landing in the spring, it wasn't me, the guy with almost no experience
in retractables, but my partner, who has probably spent more time in the
air than I've spent alive.
Owning an aircraft also wasn't a problem, although it's certainly been
more work than simply using club aircraft. While I originally wanted to
own an entire glider outright, it turned out that buying into a
partnership was an incredibly smart move, because that gave me an
instant ready pool of knowledge. Assembly/disassembly, trailering,
inspection preparations, instrument usage, installing a gear warning
system, diagnosing an unresponsive airspeed indicator, all of this was
helped enormously by having partners (and also by having the seller
nearby).
Money wasn't a worry to me, but it's still something I thought about. So
far, so good. I put 55.4 hours on it over the past year, and my share of
the costs have been around $700, which works out to under $13/hour.
Beats renting club aircraft, even ignoring the fact that mine is far,
far nicer than the club's. (Of course I'm cleverly ignoring opportunity
cost on the purchase price, depreciation, etc., and I still have to pay
the regular rate for tows, but still, it's nicely cheap.)
On the plus side, wow, what a machine. I love this glider the way a
normal person might love a woman. It's just an absolute joy to fly.
The performance is incredible. The book promises a 43:1 glide ratio, and
it delivers. At high speeds, it still flies practically flat. On a good
day I'll just set off cross country spontaneously, and only once in the
past year have I not made it back home. (And even then I still made it
to an airport.) Climb performance is also nice, although I wouldn't call
it a "floater". The flaps allow me to fly slow and turn tightly in a
thermal, more so than otherwise.
Landing performance is just breathtaking. Full flaps, full spoilers, and
Vne for that combination (which is a mere 65kts) gives me a 2:1 glide
slope and an incredibly short rollout. I haven't had to land it in a
field yet, but when that day comes, I have no worries about my ability
to squeeze it into a small one.
It's also pretty comfortable, which is important when I'm in it for 5+
hours at a time. The only downside is that the cockpit is kind of small,
so I can't stretch out much, especially on the legs and feet, but this
isn't a big deal. Performance and comfort were the two things that
really bugged me about the otherwise-great 1-26 that a good friend was
letting me fly before, and they're why I didn't buy a 1-26 of my own.
It's a piece of cake to assemble, which means I'm not afraid to fly it
on marginal days. I'm the envy of anyone assembling the club's Open
Cirrus, and of my friend who owns a Ventus, as my wings line up and lock
together like magnets every time. (For those of you who fly powered
aircraft, the idea of assembling your plane before you fly it every day
may sound strange and frightening. It's actually pretty easy to do, at
least if you have the right kind of glider. It only takes me about 30
minutes from start to finish, and most of that is doing fiddly little
bits like hooking up the controls or taping up the gaps on the wings and
tail.)
And of course, it's *mine*, which means that on a good day I can fly it
for as long as I'm wiling and able to keep it airborne, rather than
being called down after an hour or two like in club aircraft. I can also
take it cross country, something which is de facto not allowed in club
gliders. And, although I haven't taken advantage of this yet, I can take
it to other airports and fly it there.
55.4 hours and 35 flights in a year. A lot of those flights were
familiarization flights or just fun flights when conditions didn't
permit soaring, so my average soaring flight time is probably 2+ hours,
with the best one at nearly 6 hours. I haven't kept close track, but
I've made several cross country flights, totaling maybe 500 miles, which
is pretty good considering that I haven't been pushing it hard at all as
I get used to it.
All in all, it's been a great year. All of the good things that I
anticipated in owning an aircraft have come true, and none of the bad
things. It was a great choice, and I'm looking forward to another year
with it.
--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon
Sounds like everything's going according
to plan. You're a better man than me if you
can share ownership. Incidental damage would
really tick me off.

Don't lose your ability to enjoy passing time
doing something for fun. I'm getting to where it
seems necessary to quickly "get there" and then
achieve something.

---
Mark
Jeffrey Bloss
2009-12-04 16:20:58 UTC
Permalink
I shoot from the hip
Don’t ya quibble or quip
Or I’ll pop that smile
Right off o yo lip
You ain’t the one
Sayin sink or float
You ain’t the bitch
That’s Drivin this boat
Jus keep on whinin
And I’ll sink this ship
I told you once
I shoot from the hip
I shoot from the hip
(kinda sings like "blue suede shoes"
but rougher)
---
Mark
http://www.nntpnews.net/f4508/re-new-collective-poem-i-shoot-hip-5674331/
lol

Hey, Markie, you're soooooooo hip. lol
--
_?_ Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
(@ @) Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-oOO-(_)--OOo-------------------------------[ Groucho Marx ]--
grok! Devoted Microsoft User
RC_"Eddie" Moonpie
2009-12-04 20:01:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeffrey Bloss
I shoot from the hip
Don’t ya quibble or quip
Or I’ll pop that smile
Right off o yo lip
You ain’t the one
Sayin sink or float
You ain’t the bitch
That’s Drivin this boat
Jus keep on whinin
And I’ll sink this ship
I told you once
I shoot from the hip
I shoot from the hip
(kinda sings like "blue suede shoes"
but rougher)
---
Mark
http://www.nntpnews.net/f4508/re-new-collective-poem-i-shoot-hip-5674331/
lol
Hey, Markie, you're soooooooo hip. lol
WTF?

Like "Blue Suede Shoes" only /rougher/?
Jeffrey Bloss
2009-12-04 20:02:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by RC_"Eddie" Moonpie
Post by Jeffrey Bloss
I shoot from the hip
Don’t ya quibble or quip
Or I’ll pop that smile
Right off o yo lip
You ain’t the one
Sayin sink or float
You ain’t the bitch
That’s Drivin this boat
Jus keep on whinin
And I’ll sink this ship
I told you once
I shoot from the hip
I shoot from the hip
(kinda sings like "blue suede shoes"
but rougher)
---
Mark
http://www.nntpnews.net/f4508/re-new-collective-poem-i-shoot-hip-5674331/
lol
Hey, Markie, you're soooooooo hip. lol
WTF?
Like "Blue Suede Shoes" only /rougher/?
Careful, Mark(ie) shoots from his weetle troll hip.

LOL
LOL
LOL!
--
_?_ Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
(@ @) Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-oOO-(_)--OOo-------------------------------[ Groucho Marx ]--
grok! Devoted Microsoft User
Mike Ash
2009-12-04 17:54:20 UTC
Permalink
In article
Post by Mark
Sounds like everything's going according
to plan. You're a better man than me if you
can share ownership. Incidental damage would
really tick me off.
It helps that, of my two partners, one never flies it, and the other is
so vastly and incredibly more experienced than I am that I can only look
up to him.

I remember very clearly when he landed gear up, as I was the club's duty
officer that day and watched it happen. I even argued with him on the
radio while he was on final about it, because he was absolutely
convinced it was down until he had ground out a long white stripe on the
runway.

I was shocked, and a little angry, and worried about his mental state.
But my main reaction was, if it can happen to him, it can *definitely*
happen to me.... And thus I enthusiastically helped out with the
installation of our gear warning system after we got it back from the
shop.
Post by Mark
Don't lose your ability to enjoy passing time
doing something for fun. I'm getting to where it
seems necessary to quickly "get there" and then
achieve something.
Well, a push to "get there" is hard to maintain in a glider. On the
other hand, I have noticed that, like a drug, I seem to need more and
more achievement as time goes buy. I remember back when soaring for
30-40 minutes was fantastic. Now a 3-hour flight is just kind of ho-hum,
especially if I only stay local. Still, I try to keep in mind relative
achievement, that if I stay up for 30 minutes on an otherwise dead day,
that's a major accomplishment too. So far, so good....
--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon
Mark Hansen
2009-12-04 16:10:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Ash
Since the last one seemed to work pretty well, here's another
cross-posted shot at injecting some relevant content into the group.
Wow! Thanks for the write-up, Mike. Gliders is one aspect of flying
that I'm still considering and sure love reading of your exploits.

Due to finances, I've had to reduce the amount of flying that I'm
doing, but just went out the other day to maintain my currency and
had a really wonderful flying day. It made me realize that I really
don't want to let anything get in the way of my ability to fly!

Thanks again for sharing. By the way, I think you should have
included rec.aviation.owning.

Best Regards,
--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane
Member, Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA
Mike Ash
2009-12-04 17:35:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Hansen
Post by Mike Ash
Since the last one seemed to work pretty well, here's another
cross-posted shot at injecting some relevant content into the group.
Wow! Thanks for the write-up, Mike. Gliders is one aspect of flying
that I'm still considering and sure love reading of your exploits.
Due to finances, I've had to reduce the amount of flying that I'm
doing, but just went out the other day to maintain my currency and
had a really wonderful flying day. It made me realize that I really
don't want to let anything get in the way of my ability to fly!
Thanks again for sharing. By the way, I think you should have
included rec.aviation.owning.
I didn't think of including .owning, since I don't subscribe to it. I'll
have to check it out, since it *is* appropriate to my situation now....
--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon
Ross
2009-12-04 18:03:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Ash
Since the last one seemed to work pretty well, here's another
cross-posted shot at injecting some relevant content into the group.
My glider's condition inspection was due last month. When I bought my
share, one of the things I did as part of preparing to take ownership of
my share was to help out with last year's inspection (which gave me a
lot of valuable insight as to what everything looked like down in the
guts), meaning that it's now been a year since I bought into it.
So far I do not regret my decision to purchase in the least. I was wary
going into it, partly because owning an aircraft was something new to
me, and partly because this particular glider is much higher performance
and more complex (flaps and retractable gear) than anything I'd flown
before.
The performance and complexity turned out not to be a problem. The
ASW-20 got built in large numbers and is considered a "classic" for good
reason. I found it to be responsive without being twitchy, to handle
docilely, and to have no real bad habits. It took me about six months
before I got used to the flaps (they can be used for landing, but their
primary purpose is to increase efficiency in normal flight, so I'm
constantly moving them around as I change speeds) but ultimately that
was also no big deal. And, while the machine experienced a gear-up
landing in the spring, it wasn't me, the guy with almost no experience
in retractables, but my partner, who has probably spent more time in the
air than I've spent alive.
Owning an aircraft also wasn't a problem, although it's certainly been
more work than simply using club aircraft. While I originally wanted to
own an entire glider outright, it turned out that buying into a
partnership was an incredibly smart move, because that gave me an
instant ready pool of knowledge. Assembly/disassembly, trailering,
inspection preparations, instrument usage, installing a gear warning
system, diagnosing an unresponsive airspeed indicator, all of this was
helped enormously by having partners (and also by having the seller
nearby).
Money wasn't a worry to me, but it's still something I thought about. So
far, so good. I put 55.4 hours on it over the past year, and my share of
the costs have been around $700, which works out to under $13/hour.
Beats renting club aircraft, even ignoring the fact that mine is far,
far nicer than the club's. (Of course I'm cleverly ignoring opportunity
cost on the purchase price, depreciation, etc., and I still have to pay
the regular rate for tows, but still, it's nicely cheap.)
On the plus side, wow, what a machine. I love this glider the way a
normal person might love a woman. It's just an absolute joy to fly.
The performance is incredible. The book promises a 43:1 glide ratio, and
it delivers. At high speeds, it still flies practically flat. On a good
day I'll just set off cross country spontaneously, and only once in the
past year have I not made it back home. (And even then I still made it
to an airport.) Climb performance is also nice, although I wouldn't call
it a "floater". The flaps allow me to fly slow and turn tightly in a
thermal, more so than otherwise.
Landing performance is just breathtaking. Full flaps, full spoilers, and
Vne for that combination (which is a mere 65kts) gives me a 2:1 glide
slope and an incredibly short rollout. I haven't had to land it in a
field yet, but when that day comes, I have no worries about my ability
to squeeze it into a small one.
It's also pretty comfortable, which is important when I'm in it for 5+
hours at a time. The only downside is that the cockpit is kind of small,
so I can't stretch out much, especially on the legs and feet, but this
isn't a big deal. Performance and comfort were the two things that
really bugged me about the otherwise-great 1-26 that a good friend was
letting me fly before, and they're why I didn't buy a 1-26 of my own.
It's a piece of cake to assemble, which means I'm not afraid to fly it
on marginal days. I'm the envy of anyone assembling the club's Open
Cirrus, and of my friend who owns a Ventus, as my wings line up and lock
together like magnets every time. (For those of you who fly powered
aircraft, the idea of assembling your plane before you fly it every day
may sound strange and frightening. It's actually pretty easy to do, at
least if you have the right kind of glider. It only takes me about 30
minutes from start to finish, and most of that is doing fiddly little
bits like hooking up the controls or taping up the gaps on the wings and
tail.)
And of course, it's *mine*, which means that on a good day I can fly it
for as long as I'm wiling and able to keep it airborne, rather than
being called down after an hour or two like in club aircraft. I can also
take it cross country, something which is de facto not allowed in club
gliders. And, although I haven't taken advantage of this yet, I can take
it to other airports and fly it there.
55.4 hours and 35 flights in a year. A lot of those flights were
familiarization flights or just fun flights when conditions didn't
permit soaring, so my average soaring flight time is probably 2+ hours,
with the best one at nearly 6 hours. I haven't kept close track, but
I've made several cross country flights, totaling maybe 500 miles, which
is pretty good considering that I haven't been pushing it hard at all as
I get used to it.
All in all, it's been a great year. All of the good things that I
anticipated in owning an aircraft have come true, and none of the bad
things. It was a great choice, and I'm looking forward to another year
with it.
Nice report. I had my plane for 12 years and I agree with you. It was
available with I wanted and didn't have to worry about anyone else. Plus
I did owner assisted annuals and all repairs (with A&P/IA oversight). I
KNEW my plane inside and out. In 2001 we installed a factory overhauled
Lycoming O-360.

You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)

I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI
Mike Ash
2009-12-04 18:16:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I expect to be able to sell my share for the same price I bought it for.
This means depreciation will roughly follow inflation, which is not a
lot, but it adds up.

The big worry is a refinish job at some point in the distant future. My
gelcoat is in fantastic shape considering that it's almost 25 years old,
but someday it will have to be redone, and the cost of that is likely to
be 1/3rd-1/2 of the total cost of the aircraft.
Post by Ross
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
Sorry to hear about that. I know it's not the same thing at all, but one
of the benefits of flying gliders is that the only medical exam you have
to go through is asking yourself in the morning, "Am I fit to fly?
Yep...."

I've watched many fellow glider pilots who also fly powered aircraft
lose their medicals and struggle to get them back, and it's so
frustrating. One lost his medical due to a Hepatitis C infection! He was
robust, healthy, continued to fly gliders all throughout with no
problems, but somehow this disqualified him. He was fortunate enough to
be cured of the infection and finally got his medical back, but it's
just all so crazy.
--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon
Mark
2009-12-04 18:39:54 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going LSA?

---
Mark
george
2009-12-04 19:41:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going LSA?
We have a different set of medical requirements for Microlite/
Ultralites.
A lot of older pilots here who have failed their medicals go flying
microlites
Ross
2009-12-07 18:08:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by george
Post by Mark
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going LSA?
We have a different set of medical requirements for Microlite/
Ultralites.
A lot of older pilots here who have failed their medicals go flying
microlites
Do you know still have to self "certify" that you are fit to fly? In the
US if you fail your medical you cannot fly LSA. If you let your medical
expire and do not renew it then you can fly LSA. But you still have to
self certify.
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI
Jeffrey Bloss
2009-12-07 18:22:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ross
Post by george
Post by Mark
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going LSA?
We have a different set of medical requirements for Microlite/
Ultralites.
A lot of older pilots here who have failed their medicals go flying
microlites
Do you know still have to self "certify" that you are fit to fly? In the
US if you fail your medical you cannot fly LSA. If you let your medical
expire and do not renew it then you can fly LSA. But you still have to
self certify.
This whole LSA medical certification is a nightmare, all this don't
tell-fly crap is absurd. But so is kids flying and they are up in the
skies as well.

I'm not sure whether it is the spirit of the FARs or the regs itself
that say if you know you have a medically limiting condition, then you
should ground yourself from flying anything. Maybe even kites. lol
--
_?_ Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
(@ @) Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-oOO-(_)--OOo-------------------------------[ Groucho Marx ]--
grok! Devoted Microsoft User
Franklin
2009-12-07 23:19:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeffrey Bloss
Post by Ross
Post by george
Post by Mark
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I
sold it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost
twice what I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH
engine, and during the time all avionics were OH and I did add a
IFR GPS. (No, not any fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going LSA?
We have a different set of medical requirements for Microlite/
Ultralites. A lot of older pilots here who have failed their
medicals go flying microlites
Do you know still have to self "certify" that you are fit to fly? In
the US if you fail your medical you cannot fly LSA. If you let your
medical expire and do not renew it then you can fly LSA. But you
still have to self certify.
This whole LSA medical certification is a nightmare, all this don't
tell-fly crap is absurd. But so is kids flying and they are up in the
skies as well.
I'm not sure whether it is the spirit of the FARs or the regs itself
that say if you know you have a medically limiting condition, then you
should ground yourself from flying anything. Maybe even kites. lol
You forgot to mention being grounded from flying your model aircraft.

Just an oversight was it?

Jeffrey Bloss
2009-12-04 19:57:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going JLA?
---
Markie aka Wonder Woman
JLA? Did youmean the *Justice League of America*, Mark(ie)?

<snickers galore>

http://tinyurl.com/ykd8ofh or

<http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:pHzTjEWChHYJ:www.jlaforums.com/viewtopic.php%3Fp%3D30617549+blueriverday%40yahoo.com&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us>

Don't you think that Wonder Woman's red pooseypants clash with Aquaman's
flippers?

*BWahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa*
--
_?_ Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
(@ @) Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-oOO-(_)--OOo-------------------------------[ Groucho Marx ]--
grok! Devoted Microsoft User
Subterranean Cinema
2009-12-04 19:59:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeffrey Bloss
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going JLA?
---
Markie aka Wonder Woman
JLA? Did youmean the *Justice League of America*, Mark(ie)?
<snickers galore>
http://tinyurl.com/ykd8ofh or
<http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:pHzTjEWChHYJ:www.jlaforums.com/viewtopic.php%3Fp%3D30617549+blueriverday%40yahoo.com&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us>
Don't you think that Wonder Woman's red pooseypants clash with Aquaman's
flippers?
*BWahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa*
Is this guy 12?
george
2009-12-04 22:09:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Subterranean Cinema
Post by Jeffrey Bloss
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going JLA?
---
Markie aka Wonder Woman
JLA? Did youmean the *Justice League of America*, Mark(ie)?
<snickers galore>
http://tinyurl.com/ykd8ofhor
<http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:pHzTjEWChHYJ:www.jlaforums.com/vi...>
Don't you think that Wonder Woman's red pooseypants clash with Aquaman's
flippers?
*BWahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa*
Is this guy 12?
IQ points or age ?
Subterranean Cinema
2009-12-04 22:27:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by george
Post by Subterranean Cinema
Post by Jeffrey Bloss
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going JLA?
---
Markie aka Wonder Woman
JLA? Did youmean the *Justice League of America*, Mark(ie)?
<snickers galore>
http://tinyurl.com/ykd8ofhor
<http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:pHzTjEWChHYJ:www.jlaforums.com/vi...>
Don't you think that Wonder Woman's red pooseypants clash with Aquaman's
flippers?
*BWahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa*
Is this guy 12?
IQ points or age ?
Either. Even *I* know the Justice League of America is passe'.
Frank Camper
2009-12-04 22:50:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Subterranean Cinema
Post by george
Post by Subterranean Cinema
Post by Jeffrey Bloss
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going JLA?
---
Markie aka Wonder Woman
JLA? Did youmean the *Justice League of America*, Mark(ie)?
<snickers galore>
http://tinyurl.com/ykd8ofhor
<http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:pHzTjEWChHYJ:www.jlaforums.com/vi...>
Don't you think that Wonder Woman's red pooseypants clash with Aquaman's
flippers?
*BWahahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa*
Is this guy 12?
IQ points or age ?
Either. Even *I* know the Justice League of America is passe'.
I liked the kid. He turned out to be a turd.

Fact.
--
Live To Spend It
Jim Logajan
2009-12-04 20:26:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeffrey Bloss
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I
sold it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost
twice what I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH
engine, and during the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR
GPS. (No, not any fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going JLA?
---
Markie aka Wonder Woman
JLA? Did youmean the *Justice League of America*, Mark(ie)?
<snickers galore>
Hey BOZO - you just fucked yourself. You DO realize that you've just
committed libel by deliberately attributing your own text to someone else?
He now has a bonafide reason to subpoena the records of eternal-
september.org as well as the ISP that owns the IP address the org recorded,
thereby finding out who you are and sue you for said libel?

I know you've been doing that illegal crap with other posts, so just wanted
to make clear to you that thanks to various archives, there is now
permanent evidence of your libel all around the Internet and it is just a
matter of time whether anyone takes action.

My advice to you is before you and your family lose what little finances
they have to legal action that you contact a lawyer and ask them just how
far out you've hung your ass.
Jeffrey Bloss
2009-12-04 22:28:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jim Logajan
Post by Jeffrey Bloss
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I
sold it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost
twice what I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH
engine, and during the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR
GPS. (No, not any fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going JLA?
---
Markie aka Wonder Woman
JLA? Did youmean the *Justice League of America*, Mark(ie)?
<snickers galore>
Hey BOZO - you just fucked yourself. You DO realize that you've just
committed libel by deliberately attributing your own text to someone else?
He now has a bonafide reason to subpoena the records of eternal-
september.org as well as the ISP that owns the IP address the org recorded,
thereby finding out who you are and sue you for said libel?
OH NO I AM SO SCREWED PUHLEESE DONT HURT ME!

<sniggers>
Post by Jim Logajan
I know you've been doing that illegal crap with other posts, so just wanted
to make clear to you that thanks to various archives, there is now
permanent evidence of your libel all around the Internet and it is just a
matter of time whether anyone takes action.
My advice to you is before you and your family lose what little finances
they have to legal action that you contact a lawyer and ask them just how
far out you've hung your ass.
OH THANK YOU VELLY VELLY MUCH JIMMIE FOR THE KIND ADVICE.

Fuckwit that you are.

<laff>
--
_?_ Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
(@ @) Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-oOO-(_)--OOo-------------------------------[ Groucho Marx ]--
grok! Devoted Microsoft User
Mark Hansen
2009-12-04 20:49:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going LSA?
---
Mark
LSA requires that you not have had an FAA medical revoked. One can
still fly Ultralights (as defined in Part 103), but the vehicles are
limited (single-seat, no more than 5 gallons of gas, no more than
254lbs, etc.).

This is specific to the U.S. Other countries have different regulations.
Mark
2009-12-05 00:43:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark Hansen
Post by Mark
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going LSA?
---
Mark
LSA requires that you not have had an FAA medical revoked. One can
still fly Ultralights (as defined in Part 103), but the vehicles are
limited (single-seat, no more than 5 gallons of gas, no more than
254lbs, etc.).
This is specific to the U.S. Other countries have different regulations.
Thanks, I knew that, but then I wasn't sure if his
had been revoked or he'd just been inactive and knew
he wouldn't pass a new medical. I've run across a few
pilots who had to make a transition to LSA, which is
something I've had on my mind lately, i.e., buying an
Arion Lightning (138mph cruise), and knowing that I
can fly it for the next 25 years if I'm able.

---
Mark
Jeffrey Bloss
2009-12-05 01:01:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark
Post by Mark Hansen
Post by Mark
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going LSA?
---
Mark
LSA requires that you not have had an FAA medical revoked. One can
still fly Ultralights (as defined in Part 103), but the vehicles are
limited (single-seat, no more than 5 gallons of gas, no more than
254lbs, etc.).
This is specific to the U.S. Other countries have different regulations.
Thanks, I knew that, but then I wasn't sure if his
had been revoked or he'd just been inactive and knew
he wouldn't pass a new medical. I've run across a few
pilots who had to make a transition to LSA, which is
something I've had on my mind lately, i.e., buying an
Arion Lightning (138mph cruise), and knowing that I
can fly it for the next 25 years if I'm able.
---
Markie the Troll
Mark(ie)'s gonna buy an plane!

LOL

*BWAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA*
--
_?_ Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
(@ @) Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-oOO-(_)--OOo-------------------------------[ Groucho Marx ]--
grok! Devoted Microsoft User
Jeffrey Bloss
2009-12-05 23:11:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark
I've run across a few
pilots who had to make a transition to LSA, which is
something I've had on my mind lately, i.e., buying an
Arion Lightning (138mph cruise), and knowing that I
can fly it for the next 25 years if I'm able.
---
Mark(ie) in misc.writing, you wrote "I'm retired now, having spent my
first 65 years working to make my fortune."

Expect to live and fly to 90, Mark(ie) you lying buffoon?
--
_?_ Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
(@ @) Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-oOO-(_)--OOo-------------------------------[ Groucho Marx ]--
grok! Devoted Microsoft User
Ross
2009-12-07 18:11:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark
Post by Mark Hansen
Post by Mark
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going LSA?
---
Mark
LSA requires that you not have had an FAA medical revoked. One can
still fly Ultralights (as defined in Part 103), but the vehicles are
limited (single-seat, no more than 5 gallons of gas, no more than
254lbs, etc.).
This is specific to the U.S. Other countries have different regulations.
Thanks, I knew that, but then I wasn't sure if his
had been revoked or he'd just been inactive and knew
he wouldn't pass a new medical. I've run across a few
pilots who had to make a transition to LSA, which is
something I've had on my mind lately, i.e., buying an
Arion Lightning (138mph cruise), and knowing that I
can fly it for the next 25 years if I'm able.
---
Mark
I let mine expire.
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI
Jeffrey Bloss
2009-12-04 22:30:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mark
Post by Ross
You made a comment about depreciation. Mine did not depreciate. I sold
it this year and even in a down economy I sold it for almost twice what
I bought it for. Not bad. Like I said, it got a OH engine, and during
the time all avionics were OH and I did add a IFR GPS. (No, not any
fancy Garmin item)
I wish I still had it. D*** medical....
--
Regards, Ross
C-172F 180HP
Sold :(
KSWI-
What about going LSA?
---
Mark
A *real* pilot would know you can't flunk you're physical and back into
a PPL, Mark(ie).

Back to the comic book store for you, Sweetie.
--
_?_ Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend.
(@ @) Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.
-oOO-(_)--OOo-------------------------------[ Groucho Marx ]--
grok! Devoted Microsoft User
Loading...