Discussion:
Lesson Two
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Scott
2009-05-31 00:18:55 UTC
Permalink
Some improvement with level turns today, but not enough better, just can't
seem to get enough elevator in. I confessed that I might have got too "book
smart" about lift and load factors, and might be scared of getting into a
stall with too much elevator. So we bagged that part of the lesson and
climbed up a bit to do a couple of stalls. They're fun! Riding through
them really illustrated just how far from stalling we were in those level
turns, and I'm looking forward to working them some more.

Some improvement with the rudder, too. I still get on it late in a turn,
but I *am* beginning to notice and make the correction, meaning that my
ability to divide my attention is improving. I've found that I can keep us
going fairly straight during the takeoff roll, and that's nice to know. On
final I'm not even -thinking- about the rudder, but I expect that to
improve. Apparently I have some anxiety about landing, but after flying
four approaches I can already feel it easing.

I'm also learning to relax on the yoke a little. All of my flying so far
has been in bumpy air, and I was working awfully hard to keep the wings
level. Turns out that the airplane doesn't need constant attention, just a
nudge when a trend starts to develop. That's something I read before, but I
guess it takes experience to believe it.

Next we did some constant rate climbs and descents. Yuck. I thought the
turbulence was making it hard to nail down and said so. My instructor
conceded the point, he was having trouble making a decent demonstration of
it himself. I will definitely try a few after-sunset flights to see if
calmer air will help me understand; it's hard to figure out what's going on
when I can't tell whether it's me or the wind that's moving the airplane
around.

Next, more approach work! I'm getting incrementally better with speed
control, can't remember the landing checklist for jack, and need to work on
runway alignment. We were using runway 16 with a nice little 12kt breeze
from 180, just enough to be interesting and show me why ground reference
maneuvers are important.

Oh, yes -- the artificial leg. I thought I'd try wearing it today, thinking
I'd see if it improved my rudder work. That did not work out. The 172N I'm
flying is older than the one I had for my discovery flight, the door and
seat geometry is different, and I just could *not* get into the airplane
wearing my leg! So, me being me, I took out the allen wrench I'd brought,
unbolted my leg from the knee down and threw it in the back seat. That's
always good for getting a laugh out of your flight instructor.

But while I had it there and unbolted, I had a chance to see how the foot
and ankle interact with the rudder pedal. I saw that with the ankle fixed
at 90 degrees as it is, my knee would actually have to be under the seat
before I could actuate the rudder without hitting the brake as well. I've
no idea how I could possibly manage a left crosswind landing that way.

So today I got in more one-legged taxi practice, and did OK. I still go
slow, much to my embarrassment when another airplane is waiting patiently at
the hold-short, but managed to complete all of our taxi maneuvers without
assistance. So some progress there.

The syllabus says that next up is more approach-type flight. I expect
there'll be quite a lot of that.
--
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Mike Ash
2009-05-31 02:44:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott
Some improvement with level turns today, but not enough better, just can't
seem to get enough elevator in. I confessed that I might have got too "book
smart" about lift and load factors, and might be scared of getting into a
stall with too much elevator. So we bagged that part of the lesson and
climbed up a bit to do a couple of stalls. They're fun! Riding through
them really illustrated just how far from stalling we were in those level
turns, and I'm looking forward to working them some more.
This is funny. When I started reading your message, I got to the first
part of this paragraph and thought, "tell him he should just try some
stalls, and then he won't be afraid anymore". Looks like you're way
ahead of me there. It sounds like you have the perfect attitude for
improving your skills: if something scares you or trips you up, you go
out and confront it and fix it. This will take you far.

(Incidentally, in most gliders it's not possible to stall the thing in
more than a 20-30 degree bank with the nose in a normal attitude,
because there is not enough elevator authority to reach a stall with the
extra load factor. Anyone know if the same is true for your typical
single engine piston craft?)
Post by Scott
I'm also learning to relax on the yoke a little. All of my flying so far
has been in bumpy air, and I was working awfully hard to keep the wings
level. Turns out that the airplane doesn't need constant attention, just a
nudge when a trend starts to develop. That's something I read before, but I
guess it takes experience to believe it.
Much of learning to fly, it seems, is simply learning to relax and have
a light touch. (That's trickier than it sounds, of course, because you
need to have the *right kind* of light touch for it to work. Still,
that's the goal.)
Post by Scott
Next we did some constant rate climbs and descents. Yuck. I thought the
turbulence was making it hard to nail down and said so. My instructor
conceded the point, he was having trouble making a decent demonstration of
it himself. I will definitely try a few after-sunset flights to see if
calmer air will help me understand; it's hard to figure out what's going on
when I can't tell whether it's me or the wind that's moving the airplane
around.
This is an example of another reason why I like reading your posts: they
show me interesting aspects of powered flying that I either forgot about
from my long-ago crack at it or that I wasn't exposed to. For me, a
constant-rate climb means centering the thermal so that my vario beeps
the same tone at me all the way around the circle!

Anyway, congratulations on your continued progress and please keep
posting these reports, they are most enjoyable to read.
--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon
Scott
2009-06-01 02:08:02 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 30 May 2009 22:44:53 -0400, in rec.aviation.student, Mike Ash
Post by Mike Ash
(Incidentally, in most gliders it's not possible to stall the thing in
more than a 20-30 degree bank with the nose in a normal attitude,
because there is not enough elevator authority to reach a stall with the
extra load factor. Anyone know if the same is true for your typical
single engine piston craft?)
I'm fuzzy on the relationship between airspeed, load factor, and critical
AoA. Right now I've got "you can't stall it in a turn" for maneuvers over
the training area, and "don't stall it in a turn" during slow flight to
final. Sounds like a good topic for discussion with my FI.
Post by Mike Ash
Anyway, congratulations on your continued progress and please keep
posting these reports, they are most enjoyable to read.
Thank you for saying so, Mike. I got a lot of inspiration from others
posting their training experience (thanks, Phil!) and hope to return the
favor.

I've also found that the process of writing is helping me to think through
each lesson and understand the essential elements of it. So far I've ended
each flight in sensory overload; my FI's postflight briefings might just as
well be a Jabberwocky recital, for all the sense I can make of them at the
time. A few hours' rest and some time to think it over make a big
difference. I trust that this, too, will improve with time and experience.
--
Due to Usenet spam, emailed replies must pass an intelligence test: if
you want me to read your reply, be sure to include this line of text in
your email, but remove this line before sending, otherwise my filters
will delete your email with all due prejudice. Thanks!
Mark Hansen
2009-06-01 02:35:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott
On Sat, 30 May 2009 22:44:53 -0400, in rec.aviation.student, Mike Ash
Post by Mike Ash
(Incidentally, in most gliders it's not possible to stall the thing in
more than a 20-30 degree bank with the nose in a normal attitude,
because there is not enough elevator authority to reach a stall with the
extra load factor. Anyone know if the same is true for your typical
single engine piston craft?)
I'm fuzzy on the relationship between airspeed, load factor, and critical
AoA.
Just remember that as the load factor goes up, so does your stall speed.

Just think about how much lift is needed to hold the airplane up in the
air. When the load factor goes up, more lift is needed. How do you create
more lift (assuming a constant airspeed)? Higher angle of attack.

If course you can only increase the angle of attack so far before the wing
stalls. So, at a certain load factor, what would have been a reasonable
flying speed will now result in a stall.
Post by Scott
Right now I've got "you can't stall it in a turn" for maneuvers over
I assume what you mean is that you're being told not to stall in that
situation, not that the airplane can't stall in that situation :-)
Post by Scott
the training area, and "don't stall it in a turn" during slow flight to
final. Sounds like a good topic for discussion with my FI.
Right. Practicing stall characteristics is a good idea. Practicing them
when low to the ground is a no-no (in the biggest sense) :-)
Post by Scott
Post by Mike Ash
Anyway, congratulations on your continued progress and please keep
posting these reports, they are most enjoyable to read.
Thank you for saying so, Mike. I got a lot of inspiration from others
posting their training experience (thanks, Phil!) and hope to return the
favor.
Well, these posts are good for all, not just those now going through
training.
Post by Scott
I've also found that the process of writing is helping me to think through
each lesson and understand the essential elements of it. So far I've ended
each flight in sensory overload; my FI's postflight briefings might just as
well be a Jabberwocky recital, for all the sense I can make of them at the
time. A few hours' rest and some time to think it over make a big
difference.
I did the same thing - although I didn't post them. Not because I didn't
want to share, but mine included lots of internal dialog, etc., which
wouldn't have been very interesting reading. The brain dumps did help,
however. It really amazed me just how much I could remember about what
happened that day just by relaxing, sitting at my desk and writing.
Post by Scott
I trust that this, too, will improve with time and experience.
Well, yes - until you start Instrument Training :-)

... just kidding. I had a lot of fun with my Instrument Training. But I'm
feeling much better now ;-)
--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane, USUA Ultralight Pilot
Cal Aggie Flying Farmers
Sacramento, CA
Mike Ash
2009-06-01 16:01:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Scott
On Sat, 30 May 2009 22:44:53 -0400, in rec.aviation.student, Mike Ash
Post by Mike Ash
(Incidentally, in most gliders it's not possible to stall the thing in
more than a 20-30 degree bank with the nose in a normal attitude,
because there is not enough elevator authority to reach a stall with the
extra load factor. Anyone know if the same is true for your typical
single engine piston craft?)
I'm fuzzy on the relationship between airspeed, load factor, and critical
AoA. Right now I've got "you can't stall it in a turn" for maneuvers over
the training area, and "don't stall it in a turn" during slow flight to
final. Sounds like a good topic for discussion with my FI.
Put simply (and I hope someone will jump in and correct me if I'm
wrong), load factor acts just like weight, and the airspeed at which you
reach the critical AoA goes up with the square root of your weight. So
if your load factor is 1.4, it's like you weigh 40% more than normal.
Square root of 1.4 is about 1.2, so your stall speed is 20% higher than
normal.

There's an added complication for you guys with those spinning things up
front, which is that (I think!) prop wash will increase your elevator
authority beyond what you'd otherwise get.

In my club's trainers I can't even stall them while level if I approach
it too slowly. If I gradually reduce airspeed, I'll end up with the
stick against the back stop, the glider flying along very slowly but
above stall, and that's that. I have to pick up speed, use that speed to
get the nose up, then hold it high and let it stall from there. The CG
is far forward (but still within limits) with my fat ass up front and
there just isn't enough elevator to overcome that.
--
Mike Ash
Radio Free Earth
Broadcasting from our climate-controlled studios deep inside the Moon
Roger (K8RI)
2009-06-29 17:53:20 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 01 Jun 2009 02:08:02 GMT,
Post by Scott
On Sat, 30 May 2009 22:44:53 -0400, in rec.aviation.student, Mike Ash
Post by Mike Ash
(Incidentally, in most gliders it's not possible to stall the thing in
more than a 20-30 degree bank with the nose in a normal attitude,
because there is not enough elevator authority to reach a stall with the
extra load factor. Anyone know if the same is true for your typical
single engine piston craft?)
This is getting a bit old, but most of the prop planes I've flown
could be stalled in almost any attitude.
Post by Scott
I'm fuzzy on the relationship between airspeed, load factor, and critical
AoA. Right now I've got "you can't stall it in a turn" for maneuvers over
the training area, and "don't stall it in a turn" during slow flight to
final. Sounds like a good topic for discussion with my FI.
Post by Mike Ash
Anyway, congratulations on your continued progress and please keep
posting these reports, they are most enjoyable to read.
Thank you for saying so, Mike. I got a lot of inspiration from others
posting their training experience (thanks, Phil!) and hope to return the
favor.
I've also found that the process of writing is helping me to think through
each lesson and understand the essential elements of it. So far I've ended
each flight in sensory overload; my FI's postflight briefings might just as
well be a Jabberwocky recital, for all the sense I can make of them at the
time. A few hours' rest and some time to think it over make a big
difference. I trust that this, too, will improve with time and experience.
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